The Dogman: American Pitbull Terrier vs Ovcharka?
There seems to be a misguided few who believe that the Russian Caucasian Ovcharka can compete with the APBT.
I ask you to give me your opinions and let's have a proper discussion/ debate.
Answers and Views:
Answer by RA
There is nothing on the planet (200 lbs. or under) that can whip a game American Pitbull Terrier (40-65lb). Anyone that suggests any dog or wolf has a chance is ill-informed.
Photo Credit: This Year's Love/Flickr CC
Answer by Hengus
Ovcharkas take it 9 times out of 10. 200 lbs Ovcharkas coat is too thick for a 60 lbs pit bull to hurt it, simple anatomy.
Pits are undoubtedly the king of fight breeds, that is POUND FOR POUND,
some of you deluded peasants think pits can take on polar bears already,
Answer by Julien
The Ovcharka hands down is the nastiest meanest most aggressive dog I have seen. They are not just big, but agile, and yes they will destroy any 50lb, 60lb,70lb ABPT. particularly if you can get one directly from Russia.
Answer by Paddy
TRUST ME, as you could google and see the other way around, i have seen a 65 lb pit grab a full-grown Bull Cow by the face and drag him down. You “get real” as you say idiot
Answer by SGT USMC
A Kangal – Ovcharka or the like could and would do whatever it pleases with a pitbull — could mount it and breed it – kill or mame it and in heartbeat. I suppose a pit bull could get lucky sneak under the big dog and attack his genitalia — more likely the big dog would scoop the apbt up in jaws shake it like a rat and it's over (see eg Dempsey terriers and barn rats) — — the toughest apbt are not these rejects you see at 100lbs — they are what 35 – 55 lbs — — Certainly APBT can be a real game and super talented — just like Floyd “money” Mayweather — Floyd is unmatched athletic talent and practioner — but the simple fact of the matter is that a bottom of the barrel heavyweight would make him his bitch with relative ease (including even the sloppy fat pasty white guys).
Similarly – and while there are exceptions they are very rare — a 125 lb female can be a 40-degree blackbelt — but at end of the day she can kung fu all over the place and I can walk right through wrap my arms around her and it's over (this example was for arguments sake only — I have never and never would find myself in a scrap with a little karate gal) — I'm not a brightest guy but has something to do with stuff like physics — despite the commentary APBT’s are not superheroes — the bite force is limited by forces likes size or lack thereof.
Answer by Don C
You want the truth, don't you? Well here goes. I’m 65 years old and fought dogs against the likes of Don Mayfield, Don Maloney, Walter Komosinski, Pete Sweeney, Earl Tudor, Jack Kelly, Jerry Bean, I could go on but what’s the point? I won my share and lost my share. IF there was a better combat dog than the pit bull, then that’s what the pros would be using. You’re talking about a 175 lb. dog against a 50 lb pit bull. The pit bull still wins. Why? Because the Russian dog WASN’T bred for combat. I’ve seen pit bulls up against everything available and they still win. Are there exceptions to every rule? Of course. When you match a 175 dog against a 50 lb pitbull, the odds are stacked against the smaller dog.B ut, pound for pound there is NO dog capable of whipping a pit bull. As a matter of fact, I will put a 50 lb. pit bull up against any 175 lb Russian dog in the world.
There’s an old saying that goes like this, “it’s not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog.” The American Pit Bull is the world’s greatest combat animal ever bred. If you think to place a 175 lb. Russian dog against a 50 lb. pit bull you have my deepest sympathies. When the pit bull grabs the big dog by the now and won’t let go, let’s see how much screaming goes on for the big dog. And make no mistake, the pit bull IS gonna at some time or another bite the bigger dog in a place he ain’t gonna care much for. And once again, if the “pros” who fight dogs felt like the Russian dog was the best combat dog, don’t you think they’d be using them instead of the lowly pit bull? ‘Nuff said.
Answer by Alexandra
I own a Pit bull and a Pit Bull x Boerboel (South African Mastiff, loosely translated from Afrikaans to mean Farmer’s dog) and they are the sweetest and most loyal dogs I’ve ever owned. They have never shown aggression or been a danger to other people or dogs in any situation. However, I once lived and worked on a property for a year that had an Ovchaka, I will never trust that breed again. The Ovchaka was threatening and aggressive to strangers and over the course of the year that I was there, got progressively more dangerous to the point that not only did he turn on me(savagely biting my arm after I pulled him off another person he tried to bite unprovoked) after biting me he was always threatening and aggressive towards me even though we had been ‘best friends’ up until then and now he has to be kept in an enclosure because he is even a danger to his own owner and her child.
In my personal experience and opinion, Pitbulls are predictable and trustworthy. They are only ruined and made dangerous by people, however, Ovcharka’s are unpredictable and aggressive regardless of how well they are trained and how much they are loved.
STOP DOG FIGHTING!
Answer by Rob
You guys are idiots for matching a 55 lb dog, the apbt, against fighting dogs/guard dogs 2 to 3 times its weight and size. Will this argument ever end? There is not a dog on this planet in a pitbulls weight class that can beat it. A Jack Russell terrier weighs probably 15 pounds less than a pit yet it can never beat one; nor can most dogs twice its size. In order for it to meets its match you have to give it all most impossible odds to win. Fucking cowards! Then brag about what a shitty breed it is.
Lesson one: dogo’s, presa’s, corso’s, bully kuttas are all bandogs. They only took on their recent appearance within the past 20-30 yrs. And what’s the main ingredient in most modern bandogs? Apbt!
- Which would win a Kangal or a pitbull in a dog fight?
- Tosa Inu Vs American Pit Bull Terrier fight?
- Who would win in a fight between a wolf and a pitbull?
Lesson 2: the kangals you see online that are the most impressive are not purebred dogs! That’s why they are so rare even in their country of origin. These so-called “Kangals” are in fact, Boz shepherds or Malak/Kangal crosses with those that look more like Malaks being the most popular. If a so-called kangal has a hanging upper lip, and block skull and not a round one, stands up square not rectangular, has overly defined muscle definition then its not a Kangal but one of the aforementioned.
Lesson 3: the best fighting dogs in the world are bandogs! Usually, Boerboel crossed with pit, or working lines of Neo or tosa. One such dog, a Boerboel X apbt, was undefeated against all other breeds and still to this day holds the record.
Lesson 4: game pitbulls come from a separate and distinct line from just the casual show dog (aka amstaffs). These dogs are top prizefighters who lines date back several generations back to when the breed was being developed. Of course, a 120 + lbs has the advantage but what more amazing here is that sometimes, the pit wins. Self-preservation, unlike what many of the larger breeds have, is not one of their traits; it was bred out. That ‘underdog’ — that fighting spirit is not something to be looked down upon.
Lesson 5: say we even the odds and made kangals, CO’s, CAO’s, bully kuttas, tm’s all equal in weight to a pit. Things wouldn’t be so “overrated” then would they?
Know better? Give your own answer to this question!
SGT USMC says
The comment has been moved into the body of the post.
Mat says
To this bullshit artist who recons his kenkle killed a pit in less then a min, what a wanker he claimed to have had so many incidents with pit bulls and his cur kankles. PUT YOURS DOGS IN ONE OF THE GAME DOG MAGAZINES AS OPEN TO THE WORLD AT CATCH WEIGHT. I no 100% you will lose your dog. As for your ignorance about saying a pit bull could only win if the Kankel over heated or was to exorsted to fight, you idiots that why a pit is he suppream fighter, if your Kankakee doesn’t fight he loses and if he over heats he will die even easy and faster then from a broken leg you ignorant fool. Do you know how many Turkish fools have brought their kankles to Japan where dog fights are legal, it’s so funny when the japs no someone is coming they say just some ignorant fool is coming to pay us. Kenkles can’t beat a jap tosa, can’t beat a catch weight game breed pit, they can’t beat a cavkaz ether.
James Michaeal says
I have owned a wonderful male specimen Kangal that I purchased from a shepherd in the Sivas region, whom my Turkish friends introduced me to. I also currently own three Central Asian Ovtcharka dogs, two males, one female. All I can add to this argument. Is that one of my male CAO dogs was attacked on two separate occasions by Pitbull dogs, one was a Pitbull used in dogs fights, and in neither instance did the fight last longer that 15 seconds. One incident lasted perhaps 1/10 of a second resulting in the death of the Pitbull, as a major abdominal artery was ruptured by the immense canine of my dogs, after the Pitbull attacked him. In the other instance the fighting Pitbull, much to the chagrine of its owner refused to continue to fight, when on its 2nd charge of my male, my dog flung it 15 feet in the air, causing it to flip head over heels three times, get up wably, shake its head as if to say WTF was that, and walk away. There were several individuals witnessing this encounter, after which I lambasted the stupid owner for allowing his dog off leash to attack my dog. When a 55-65 lb dog, regardless of its fighting ability attacks a 194 lbs dog, bred to combat and kill predators, a massive dog that is cut and ripped, moves faster than dogs 1/2 his size, has a 28.5 inch circumference neck, paws wider than your head, claws backed by power that can and have ripped apart metal doors, a bite capacity 3X-4X that of a Pitbull, and is able to clear a 6 foot fence from a stand-still, his chances of survival are not good. Why is it that light weights do not fight championship heavy weights. My male’s sire was a fighting champion of Kazakhstan. My male also killed three coy-wolf hybrids, took down two buck deer in less than 30 seconds, and also unfortunately killed a bobcat, severing its brainsetm with his massive canines. Yes pit bulls are wonderfully athletic, tenacious, game dogs, but they simply lack the offensive weapons to defeat a good specimen Kangal or COA. Their only chances would be if the Kangal or COA failed to kill the Pitbull and following the onslaught, and onslaught it would be, the Pitbull was able to outlast the larger, more powerful dog, not beat it physically, but the larger dog stopped fightlig as it overheated and became exhausteed, or perhaps the smaller dog, with canines perhaps 1/4 to 1/5 the size of the larger dog’s canines managed to get in a 1/1000 lucky lethal bite and sever a large superficial vein or artery. I do agree with teh gentleman opining that many of the larger impressive looking Kangal are not acurally Kangal. As a person who has spent sufficing time in Turkey to become well acquainted with their endogenous dog and horse breeds, I an unequivocally state that the ANatolian Shepherd is simply a mongrelized Kangal, DNA studies have confirmed that. Furthermore, no one in Turkey recognized the ANatolian SHepherd before Europeans and Americans began brings them home and claiming they were Anatolian SHepherds, creating a kmarket in Turkey for the breeding and sale of these dogs. Most Turkish shepherds sold inferior quality specimen to foreigners and kept the select specimen for themselves, secreted away from prying eyes and hands. SO in Turkey teh kangal appear quite different in conformation that Kangal in the UK or USA. However, many of the larger, more massive “kangal” seen on the internet, are actually Turkish Mastiffs or Kangal/Turkish Mastiff hybrids. I was just resented offered a Boz, he was around 36 inches at the withers, but tended towards rear luxation, with a shoulder instability as well, and he lacked substance. Great size without proper structural integrity and an advanced neuromuscular system is of little value for either the dog or the owner.
Ethan Chauffe says
thats a complete bullshit fabricated story and you know it
DF POPOG says
Are you people retarded? There are 8 different bloodlines of the caucasian breed, all with different names.
People often buy and fight different bloodlines of caucasian dogs and call them ”ovcharkas” well I have some news for you, most of the caucasians you see are not OVCHARKAS! ”Ovcharka” is the name of the USSR Russian military bloodline of the dog, that USSR scientists invented for military purposes. That bloodline has ten times bigger prey drive, ten times stronger kill drive and is ten times more savage…
There are plenty of videos of REAL ovcharkas killing other dogs, packs of wolves and even bears, so you don’t have to theorycraft and argue, because there are videos proving that yes, the original military bloodline ovcharka is indeed the most savage dog breed (currently) in existence. You can just look it up by going on DuckDuckGo search engine and finding any reality or gore website with dogfighting videos. It’s as easy as that. REAL ovcharkas kill other animals (not just dogs) in mere seconds, it’s in their blood to avoid fighting and go straight for the throat, that’s how they were bred by Russian military and it’s in their nature, which is seen in the videos, since most of the fighting videos with real ovcharkas don’t last any longer than a minute or two at most.
As for the Pit Bull vs Ovcharka topic, is that even a real question? Just look up any videos, the APBT’s get their throats ripped open and skulls crushed in less than 30 seconds. There was even this one video where an ovcharka ripped off the APBT’s lower jaw off in just two bites and thrashes and the entire fight lasted barely 2 minutes. Even other bloodlines of caucasian dogs kill APBT’s with ease, i’ve only seen a handfull of videos where an APBT won the fight against a caucasian and even that was involving luck because the Pit usually won by getting a lucky bite on the caucasians throat or belly, so there is that…
Yes, the APBT might be a champion breed in U.S and around western EU illegal fighting rings, but most of the champions i’ve seen were either Ovcharkas or game bred CAO’s. Not even breeds like Ghadrejani, Kangal, Kuchi, Gampr and so on, were able to stand in a ring with champion Ovcharkas or CAO’s. Instead of arguing like idiots go watch some videos and you will see how your beloved game bred APBT gets killed in less than 30 seconds by most Molosser breed dogs with fighting backgrounds.
Mathew Collins says
Your an ignorant moron, in Russia the premier fighting dog is the game breed amarican pit bull terrier. Professional dog fighters with pit bulls match each other with other pit bulls of the same weight. Most pit bulls are only between 12-18kg’s. Some dogs are 20-23kg. A catch weight pit bull like MADAY for example who was considered huge by game breed pit bull standards was only 29kg’s pit weight, and he would destroy any breed of dog on this planet except maybe another bit bull.
Mat says
???
Douglas E Millar says
sORRY DAVE i DON’T BELIEVE YOUR BULLSHOT STORIES OF YOU GAMEBRED APBT, A FIGHT WITH THE WOLF MAYBE BUT NOT ABOUT THE BEES. PIT BULLS ARE FEARLESS WITH ANIMALS THEIR SIZE OR LARGER BUT NOT WITH INSECTS. IN FACT I WOULD ARGUE THE VENOM INFLICTED BY THE BEES WOULD BE ENOUGH TO KILL YOUR DOG.
Dave says
I’ve had a hundred and ten lb male that is a game bred dog and he was the baddest ass thing I’ve ever seen in my entire life my brother has had pitbulls for 30-some years or 40 years and he’s had one dog that was as Unstoppable as Poncho in all that time Pancho is our family pet of 16 years he is now getting ready to pass soon and he’s been a hero a big male cougar tried to get my kids when we were playing in the snow and Pancho got it and killed it by himself with no help from anybody he also jumped on a bee’s nest ones for my daughter when she was 5 years old and got stung over a hundred times he knew exactly what he was doing because when he saw she was away from the bees nest he got off the bees nest and rolled around and jumped in the water pitbulls are amazing dogs in more ways than just being tough but they are very very very tough I also saw Pancho and 150 pound wolf go out each other at the lake before I realized I shouldn’t take Poncho to the lake it took Poncho less than a minute to have that dog that wolf dog down and literally had it whipped could have killed him if he wanted to he of course let go when I told him to but he didn’t always let go when I told him to a few times I had to get parting sticks for him because another dog pissed him off really bad usually when they growl at his boy luke
Mat says
Dave,That’s massive for a supposedly gamebreed pit. Could you post the pedigree?